Episode 39: Habits of Success

[00:02] AD: Alliance Physical Therapy Partners in Agile Virtual Physical Therapy proudly present Agile and Me, a Physical Therapy Leadership podcast devised to help emerging and experienced therapy leaders learn more about various topics relevant to outpatient therapy services.

[00:19] Richard: Welcome back to Agile & me, a Physical Therapy Leadership Podcast series. Today I'm excited to welcome Dr. Joseph Laporte, an expert in leadership and talk about habits of success. So welcome Joe.

[00:33 ] Joseph: Thank you Richard. Excited to join you today.

[00:37 ] Richard: Thank you. So not only are you a successful leader, you are actually an author as well. And the genesis of this podcast was actually I was reading a book called Habits of Success and you'd actually written a chapter, so I was excited to chat with you about that. Before we dive into the weeds, I'd love perhaps you to talk a little bit to our listeners about your background and how your work experience has kind of helped you become the leader that you are today.

[01:09 ] Joseph: Sure, happy to walk you through that. I guess as I think about my background and where work started for me it might be a little unique in the sense that I started work very early in life. At the age of eight, my brothers and sisters and I actually worked for my father's asphalt company. So I was fetching tools in the hot sun at the, I guess the tender age of eight.

And by the age of twelve I was operating the steamroller for my father's company. So he had us out there humping very early philosophically. He was a self made man and an entrepreneur himself, so he thought most problems could be solved with good work. So he really tried to instill that ethic in us at a very young age.

So that's really where work started for me. And the only reason I mentioned that is because I think those work experiences give us an opportunity, although very young, give us an opportunity to condition ourselves, to work within a team, to understand kind of the value of the dollar, what's expected, things of that nature. So I always mention that just because I think not necessarily promoting that everybody should start work at eight, but I think for me it was certainly beneficial and really provided me a nice grounding of the definition of work and expectations and really just gave me good fundamentals.

I have been conditioned to work throughout my life. I've always enjoyed it, I've always felt like it was a path to much greater things and once again that really just came from my upbringing. Of course, when we got home from work I had to grab my baseball glove and I was sunburned and I had all kinds of, we'll say gasoline and kerosene on my arms and that's when you did your homework and that's when you played athletics, is when you got home from work. That's kind of the upbringing that I came from.

By my middle years I started to become much more academically inclined, starting to understand the value of an education. Also started playing high school sports. Got very involved in student government. So that was another, I guess, period of time where I felt like had a major impact in kind of my progression.

Once again, pre professional life. But as I think back and reflect very important in the overall path that I've taken. So I attended college, like most folks, I felt like this was the path for me. In those early years, I actually had thought that I wanted to be an attorney. So I studied law early on, and by my junior year, and I don't know if it was just hunger setting in, but I was really anxious to get out and work and start making some money and started to change direction a little bit.

By my senior year in college, I had the opportunity to do an internship. And I would recommend those experiences for anybody. But this internship really opened my eyes more on the commercial. So was actually able to work for a company called Northwestern Mutual Life. I was a college intern. It was selling life and health insurance to college students. Certainly not the ideal product that college students are interested in, but to hone my skills in understanding financial analysis, those types of solutions also give me a different perspective about the importance of thinking ahead. And believe it or not, there were college students in those days that said, hey, this is important. I need to buy some life insurance.

I had a very successful run as a college agent. But mid year, senior year, I had decided that that financial services really wasn't what really excited me. I absolutely loved the idea that you could help people. So I identified that as being very important for me moving forward. But I also became very intrigued with health care.

My father had a chronic illness. He was challenged with this through many years, and we would see him struggle with this. And I was often with him when he was going for care, et cetera. And I became intrigued with that. And I also know he was very frustrated with some of the experiences of care that he had had. So became very intrigued with that. Felt like there was a better way to create a better experience, even at that age. So became, I would say, more intrigued with health care.

And last but not least, and I had mentioned this earlier, by then I had lost my father. So my financial situation was challenged. So making money and becoming more independent became very important to me by the end of my senior year. So I figured out, hey, healthcare is my path. I think sales and marketing is probably a great fit for me at the time. And I got started, so I think I had sent out roughly 1500 resumes six months out of graduating. And of course, you play the numbers. And that garnered so many responses, which garnered so many interviews.

Was offered a job with a Fortune 50 company, which I was really excited about. And I always mention this story, but this Fortune 50 company, two weeks prior to my start, I was to start this position inside sales for a very large, prestigious company. And they called me two weeks out and said, hey, we just wanted to let that your job has been eliminated. So I thought this was pretty interesting. I hadn't even started the position yet, and I was laid off. But that was an eye opening experience for me to never take anything for granted.

The other, I think, key learning there for me was I had sent out so many resumes and had been on so many interviews that I really was getting better at the experience, understanding the questions more thoroughly, understanding how to answer them with specific examples, et cetera. So I had a plan B and C just from the quantity of experiences that I had garnered in the last six months of this activity. So although I was disappointed, I was able very quickly, within a week or two after that, was able to identify another medical supply company, family owned company.

So it wasn't that prestigious Fortune 50 company that I thought was the best path, but actually this turned out to be better for me. A smaller company gave me the opportunity to first work within the distribution and manufacturing plan. That was their path, which, learning from the ground up, I think, is just such a wonderful opportunity.

So I would recommend that for everybody. I know we always want to start in those higher positions. Maybe they feel a little more prestigious, but if you can get that hands on experience and start at the bottom, if you will, I just think it gives you a great baseline of everything else you're going to do in your career. So that's what I did my first year. I actually worked for a healthcare company in the warehouse, picking, packing, fixing medical equipment. And after about a year, I was moved into customer service and spent about three months in customer service. But what I think was really exciting for me was that an open territory opened up, an open sales territory.

Now, I was still a fairly young guy at the time, but this particular company was breaking into a new market, which was on the East Side of Chicago. Not a glamorous territory by no means, but I knew the city well. I was comfortable in those markets, and I went to work. In those days, you had a calculator, you had a catalog, and you had a bunch of samples in your trunk. And that's really, I would say, my first kind of professional experience in medical sales. And it was a new territory, and I certainly had a lot of key lessons along the way.

But that was the start. And then from that period with success and certainly with mistakes, my career began to progress. I started taking on larger territories, eventually managing 500 sales and marketing folks for a Fortune 50 company. So eventually I worked my way back to that Fortune 50 company which was really interesting, but I just took a different path perhaps. And then after managing sales and marketing for this very large national company, I had an opportunity then to take on operations.

So that was a progression going from sales, marketing, now operations, which to do that and certainly there was a lot of sacrifice along the way. Relocated six times throughout my career. I was that person that always raised my hand when the tough assignment came up or there was something that needed to be executed on. Nobody else wanted to touch it. We'll say the more riskier roles.

I was that person that was really excited about taking on those tough assignments and those new and different opportunities. So that was really my path. After taking on operations, what came upon after that was even more exciting for me because I had the opportunity to, we'll say, run your own shop, if you will, by the age of 40. Taking on a CEO role for a medical device company out of Wisconsin. That was my entree into the C suite. It was a turnaround situation, losing a couple of million dollars a year. So lots of key learnings along the way. But it was really a path that was progressive and very diverse, working in just about every now functional area of the business. Small companies, large companies, a fair amount of success and failure along the way, which I think is all think. I think that probably takes me to the C suite.

[11:36 ] Richard: Yeah, that's great. Quite a remarkable journey. I'm sure the OSHA would probably have something to say nowadays about spreading asphalt, but it's interesting that think at such a young age you experienced many life lessons that I'm sure helped you as an early careerist as well. Perhaps that perhaps if he hadn't done those things it may have slowed down perhaps the trajectory and growth as a professional.

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[12:54 ] Joseph: Yeah, one thing that we talk about in the book I can provide many examples of Adversity and often I think we shy away from Adversity or adverse situations. And whether it comes at you organically or it's kind of self inflicted Adversity in many ways really makes us better professionals. So I give the example of persistence, right. So in sales, there's a lot of rejection. However, if you study the statistics, the sales experts will tell you that a sale typically on average, is not closed until you reach at least five sales calls. Now, the average salesperson typically doesn't make two. So you learn, I think, by that rejection, how to be more persistent and how to hang in there and realize the win, if you will, by that persistence. So I think Adversity certainly teaches us a lot, teaches us to just keep at it, stay at it, makes us battle tested, how to perform under high levels of stress, if you will.

[14:07 ] Richard: Yeah, it's interesting. I think a lot of people want the comfortable road. And it's interesting part of your career, you actually purposefully chose assignments that were not only tough, but actually you had to sacrifice something. Certainly a lot of skin in the game, which I assume being heavily vested in the outcome really probably was a factor in doubling down and working even harder to be successful because that's what it took. Yes.

[14:41 ] Joseph: You bring up a good point. I think about it as I reflect on my career. I did purposely take on some tough assignments that some folks that were more senior to me said, hey Joe, are you sure you want to do this? This could be a career killer. And I was just really passionate about fixing, building, and creating those what I call before and after stories. There's nothing more exciting to stepping into an assignment or a role that's really challenged and you're able to sort it out, develop a plan, work through the chaos, and then execute on this new plan or vision. And in some situations, you're saving employees jobs, you're saving shareholder value. So I really got jazzed up, especially earlier on in my career, about those tough assignments. And I've had some startup experience where we took a company public. I've had several turnarounds that I was a part of. And when you're in it, it doesn't always feel as exciting as the idea or thought. But when you come out the other end, you look back and you think about those various scenarios that you were placed in. And what I try to tell leaders is I'm not saying that this should be your path or every leader's perpetual path, but certainly taking on a turnaround or some sort of startup during the path of your career is really beneficial. And what I tell people is more than anything, it builds your toolbox. And people look at me like and it's kind of blue collar speak, if you will, but when I talk about your toolbox, I'm talking about your skill set and your style set. Because you're placed in so many adverse situations, when you step into these assignments, you're running at a fast pace. You have to make decisions on the fly with little information, all doing this morally, ethically and legally appropriate in that manner. So I think it builds this toolbox that as you move forward in your career, you can always reach back and say, I ran into this before, and you reach back into that toolbox and maybe you pull out an appropriate style for that situation. The position brings you different situations and challenges every day. So as you excel and mature as a leader, having that toolbox to draw from those experiences really can help you respond in a more appropriate and better way.

[17:15 ] Richard: Now, in the chapter you write, you talk about a number of attributes and behaviors that really combine to lead to success. And we mentioned Adversity as one of them and we've touched on the others. But you kind of have four that you put forwards and propose as really the keys for success. Adversity is the first and then you write down, we cover them in a way relentless hard work and quality work with your experiences and what we've talked about, certainly I think we understand perhaps the relentlessness of it, the idea that you just have to keep pushing forward. You're in the trenches to a certain extent, and then you have to kind of work your way through. You can't really just kind of opt out halfway through and then hard work and quality. So I don't know if you want to perhaps expand on any of those three factors that really I believe and you write about as being the keys to success.

[18:22 ] Joseph: Sure. So, just to get realigned, I do talk about this combination in the book, and you mentioned three or four of those items. And the concept here is about the power of the experience and the attributes combined with the quantity of the work. And when you combine those two, and I'll give you some great examples, there's just this mysterious power that I think an executive can have. It takes time to kind of gain this power, if you will. But think about an attorney, an attorney who sticks with it, if you will, who's relentless starts building client base and who decides that they're going to work with more clients, who's going to have more cases. So you think about the quantity of those cases is going to increase the attorney's success. Right. Think about a clinician and physical therapy, for example. The more visits, the better acumen, the better outcome for that clinician. That's just another example. And you can think about any career, a tax accountant. The more taxes that that accountant executes on, the more they learn along the way, the faster they get and the better outcomes for their clients. So I think in pretty much every fashion you see that relentlessness, that's kind of sticking with it, right? Sticking with it. The hard work and hard work for everybody is different, right? I always talk about intensity of the work as well as the length of time that to me was a simplistic way of defining hard work. But then you combine it with this quantity day in and day out, just honing your skills. So as I think about sales, I would make sometimes 40 sales calls in a day. So after months of making 40 sales calls in a day, majority of the calls are rejection based. So many experiences with clinicians during those conversations where they're testing you, you're put into so many situations because of the quantity, you're building your expertise out. For folks that are moving up in their career, I often say, think about getting in the repetitions of what you do, and that's going to make you better at whatever you do. So that's really the concept behind that chapter and those four premises.

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[21:54 ] Richard: Yes. Touching on the concept that a lot of people want comfort rather than adversity or sacrifice. I think the other component of that is people. I find emerging leaders want a shortcut. They want to have the bigger title, the more responsibility early in their career. And I find it very difficult to slow them down and say, hey, there's some mileage that you need to complete to then be able to be successful in that larger role. And I'm trying to educate them to help them make sure they're successful in the next role. Because I know that if they don't get those experiences early on, then they're not going to be successful at some point in their career. Would you agree with that?

[22:42 ] Joseph: I totally agree, of course. And I was the same way, and you probably were the same way. I think at that point you're so excited and passionate about what you do and you want to accelerate your path. But it can be reckless if somebody, especially as a clinician, moves too quickly. Right. I think as a good leader, you do have to manage people's expectations. I think more than anything, though, and I tell a lot of clinic directors this, if you can really show your employees a path, though, show them a path to the C suite, if you will. At my current organization, I worked very closely with HR to chart out that path from the production line all the way to the C suite. I think when you can show people that, that assists with, we'll say, calming the passion down a little bit, but I think it's a good thing. And listen, if somebody moves too quickly, they could find themselves in a position where things get corrected pretty quick. You always hear that story about that person who really didn't earn it and they were promoted because of politics or relationship. That does happen, probably not as much as people think, even though sometimes we will often go to that place. But those people are typically found out pretty quick and you can get knocked back, terminated. Something catastrophic could happen. So you do want to manage your expectations with reality and of course, work closely with senior leadership to make sure that you're partnering on a path.

[24:22 ] Richard: When we talk about the four factors, the adversity, relentless hard work and quality of work, perhaps I'm diving into the weeds a little bit here, but do you think there's really a weighting at all? Do you think one is more important than the other, or is it really just equal doses of each?

[24:41 ] Joseph: Yeah, so I think that it depends on which position you are in. But I think often it is equal. But this is the difference. The difference is that it's equal in the long run. If you want to be truly a balanced leader in the short run, you might be called to do something. We'll say in the waiting scale, not at 25%, but maybe for the next six months you'll have to do something at 80%. And I have countless examples of this. There was a period of time where we needed to open up a couple manufacturing plants in Malaysia and I needed to adjust personally and professionally to get this done. So I was really focused on that. I couldn't say at that time I had a lot of balance in the various waiting scales. Now, certainly there was a lot of hard work. I was being relentless in figuring things out and getting things done. Some of it was quality. As we were ramping up, the quality improved. But I don't often think that every day is not going to be balanced. I think it's good to try, but I don't think it's realistic.

[25:54 ] Richard: Yeah, I always think with to be a good leader, I think it's three things. One is book smarts. You have to have a certain understanding of academic side, how to do something. The second is experience. And then the third is, I would say kind of street smarts. And what I feel I'm hearing is, starting at a young age, the types of things that you've done, the assignments you've had not only before college, but certainly during your career, since leaving college, has not only developed the experience side, but certainly provide you with some street smarts as well. Perhaps. I don't know if you understand what I'm trying to say, but I think there's three components, and you have to have all three to truly be successful as your leader.

[27:06 ] Joseph: Well, I think you and I both know that we can run into some leaders that are lacking perhaps in certain areas. It's not that uncommon. Many of us continue to be works in progress. But I can't disagree with anything you say. I mean, I often don't talk about my upbringing on the South Side of Chicago, in the city. But there was a lot of practicality that that gave me, once again, just kind of understanding how to maneuver in an environment that potentially was dangerous, where the people around you have a very limited vision, so you don't have a network of support. Oftentimes the options are very limited. Where I grew up, you're either going to be a crook or a cop, so you choose that path. But you mentioned education and training. I talk about often those work experiences, but along the way, I was doing all those things that I think one should do to eventually sit in our chair. And today, typically that requires a master's degree or perhaps a doctorate. I went back and got my Lean Six Sigma Black Belt certification, which was a pretty challenging program for me, but that really helped me with the operational piece that I had just taken on during that period of time. So to your point, education and training is very critical. And think about it, you can't do that typically during your nine to five day. So you're doing that in the evenings and on the weekends, which teaches you different lessons, right. Organization and once again, persistence. There were several times that you're like, do I really need to do this? It's expensive, and you're giving up part of your social life. And of course that relentlessness comes out and you're like, oh, I'm going to finish this. So I think education and training, you're absolutely right. Common sense. I think you're absolutely right. And of course, experience, and that's part of my message here is put the time in. Try to be patient. Put the time in, but don't stop learning. Do not expect that you should just float along and be on somebody else's path. You have to work with your supervisor to create your own path. You have to be active and doing research, benchmarking, talking to other people that you want to become, in essence, all that's active work. So you have to be actively engaged within your path and your journey.

[29:38 ] Richard: And what I found is once you become a senior leader, it doesn't stop, does it? Either, really. You're continually trying to, again, further develop oneself from a knowledge perspective and then experiential learning. There's unique challenges. It's not as if there's this path. And then once you get to a senior leader, it all ends and everything's rosy and you just smell the roses. It's ongoing, isn't it?

[30:10 ] Joseph: Even as a senior leader, you do think coming up in the ranks and I have to admit, early on in graduate school, there was a professor that pulled me aside and kind of abruptly said, what do you want to do with your life? And I had a good job and I was getting my master's degree. So I felt like I was in a good place. And he basically said that, listen, you got to figure out what the end game is now. And here I was, probably 24 at the time, and we spent a lot of time together. And he basically said, listen, I believe in you and I think that someday you're going to be a great CEO. And I had never had anybody tell me that. So that gave me some direction of what the possibilities could be. And I was so fortunate to have that kind of run in with a mentor and a professor because that changed my course, that advice. And I think I even still have the card that he gave me where he wrote that. From that point on, I started being pretty strategic about what I wanted to do and again, getting the right education and the right training too, making sure that I'm networking appropriately and strategically, what would be the positions I would need to be at and for how long to get to this next place. But I always understood that unless you can execute, unless you can get something done, unless you had the notches in the belt, be very difficult to get there. So I was focused on that, and I was probably at some point pretty strategic about it because of some of those interactions from mentors.

[31:51 ] Richard: I think a lot of people aren't so purposeful, are they? I don't think whilst people may have the idea of what they want their endpoint to be, they don't necessarily in detail map out that route to that point. And I think the more purposeful one is, the more likely you are to get to that point and be successful once you get to that point. So you mentioned about taking on various assignments that were very different to one another, but overall they fitted the various steps to be able to get to that end.

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[33:00 ] Joseph: They did. I mean, I've been in healthcare 33 years, and both products services, I mean, I've spent time in healthcare, It, medical supply, medical device, outpatient services, outsourced services. And each one of them, you could probably say, hey, they're different. But as I reflect on that, in so many ways, they're really not that much different. And all those experiences really helped me bring more to the next assignment. That diversity has actually been good for me. You mentioned something that's a little comical in the sense that goes back to that story. So thinking that I was going to be this CEO someday, I thought, wow, it's like. I'm the guy, I can develop the vision, I can implement full autonomy. But what you realize is as you climb the ladder, there are these other levels that once you lift your head out, head above water if you will, you've got a board of directors that you report to. And if you're somebody that and you should be somebody that's constantly challenging yourself, I think you're going to keep finding and looking for ways to improve or maybe new and different things to do that continue to elevate you intellectually and on a competitive sense.

[34:20 ] Richard: When you outline a set of rules about being relentless and we've talked about a lot of this, the idea of the right experiences, continuous learning, taking action. And the last one that I find very interesting is you say being true to oneself. What do you mean when you talk about being true to oneself?

[34:43 ] Joseph: Sure. And more probably I experienced this earlier in my career as I was learning, as I was working with customers and I was working with my own supervisors. Often we're given feedback or often things happen that aren't necessarily great along the way. And I find that sometimes some folks can be in denial. And I think it's because there's a level of embarrassment. There's this false expectation that we've got to do everything right all the time. There's optics where we believe that, hey, if someone finds this out, they're not going to think that I'm competent. They call that the impostor syndrome. But I think these things happen early on in your career. And at some point, I recognize that by reflecting on what I just experienced, and oftentimes when things didn't go right, when I was true to myself and said, what? Joe, honestly, did you handle this the best way possible or the most appropriate way? Or was there a better angle to think about before you made this decision? So I find myself, at least for the last 20 years, always looking back and doing that reflection, sometimes weekly, just to double check myself. And I think when you can do that, when you can be honest with yourself, there's a lot of growth there. I think it's a great tool to use. And by making these mistakes.

[36:15 ] Richard: If you.

[36:15 ] Joseph: Use those mistakes appropriately, that can propel your career.

[36:20 ] Richard: Yes. Interesting. It reminds me of a conversation I had with one guest about self awareness and the idea that I think it was 85% of people aren't self aware. And obviously one of the tools for self awareness is kind of reflection. And I think self awareness is so vital, isn't it? And being prepared to be critical of oneself, one's behaviors and analyze experiences to then be able to improve and move forwards. Absolutely. Obviously time is always against us on these things. What I perhaps like to ask, and again, it's a very unfair question because it really could go anywhere, is the podcast is for aspiring healthcare leaders or owners or practices as it pertains to habits for success, what we've talked about. Do you have any other final thoughts for this group that you'd like to share?

[37:29 ] Joseph: There's a lot of ingredients for success. Some of the ones that come to mind, if I were to offer them up to you, would be first and foremost, don't let anybody dictate your path forward. I'm a true believer that with some of these aspects and those qualities that you and I talked about that we're capable of doing so much. So don't let anybody dictate your future on your behalf. Take control of that. Number two, don't wing it. Oftentimes we go into meetings, we send emails, we make presentations. Perhaps it's a sales call, maybe it's a patient intervention. And I see people wing it. And I would just say that some of these interactions are just so critical to what we do in our work life that you should prepare. So make sure that you spend ample enough time preparing. There's an old saying, and this is an Abraham Lincoln saying, it's not a Joe saying, but if Abraham Lincoln had 6 hours to chop down a tree, he would spend the first 4 hours sharpening his blade. So I would say prepare. The next thing that I would say is take on those tough assignments, new and different roles, even if they're a little scary, relocate, do the startup. So take some risk in your career. And I think that'll pay dividends. The next thing is, and this is really critical, is you have to get stuff done, you have to execute, especially whether you're a clinical leader or a commercial leader, you have to develop that portfolio of before and after stories. You stepped into this, this is what you did, this was the outcome. And it really is all about just finding that way to get stuff done every day. Stay hungry would be another one. And when I say stay hungry, you mentioned it earlier, it just never stops. Continue to find a way to challenge yourself, to improve, to learn more, to be better. And probably I'll end with the last one, which you just see dying off a little bit with some of the younger generations is really understand the fundamentals of business. And what I say about that is being on time, shaking a hand appropriately, follow up, understanding the data, staying late, all those kind of fundamental things that we should know that seem to be dying off. Send a thank you think, I think those are really refreshing fundamentals that any potential employer would like.

[40:16 ] Richard: Wise words. Thank you Joe, so much. It's been a pleasure as always and certainly a lot to chew on for people to think about. So appreciate it.

[40:27 ] Joseph: Yeah. Enjoyed it.

[40:28] AD: Richard this podcast was brought to you by Alliance Physical Therapy partners. Want more expertise and information? Visit our website@alliantptp.com and follow us on social media. You can find links below in the description. As always. Thank you for listening.